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Health Tourism Phoenix: Markets rising from pandemic ashes

Health Tourism Phoenix: Markets rising from pandemic ashes October 14, 2021

Date: 14th October  2021
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    Transcript

    Health Tourism Phoenix: Markets rising from pandemic ashes
    Irving Stackpole & László Puczkó

    Laszlo Puczko Thank you very much and very good morning, very good afternoon, very good evening, depending on where you are. All these are very, very happy to have you and especially that you’re talking about such an exciting topic, which is being a phoenix. I want to walk you through their ideas that we have in mind and the major topics that we have for today’s discussion. We certainly want to refer to the handbook that we wrote together (with Irving) as one of the key materials that we always advise anybody to look into. Since it has all the hands-on recommendations to situations, especially those which we are in at the moment. 

    What’s next? Everybody wants to know what’s next, what to do because we say that the pandemic is sort of over but may not be as much over, especially as countries are closing down again and we don’t know what’s happening in the coming weeks. We are looking into situations where we have people that might say there’s a fear of not having any trips booked. And now there, apparently there’s a word for it. And not surprisingly, we know from experience – since the opening, closing, semi-opening semi-closing has been going on for several months, and even over a year. What kind of reaction do people have when they finally have the chance to book trips? Could be domestic, but also could be international. To have this “opening the floodgates” sort of experience, where suddenly a lot of people are booking trips because finally they can do it. They are also looking for more secluded locations to meet, given that they are more worried about hygiene. So these are all very standard situations. 

    But as of now, unfortunately, the question still is: What’s next? What should the industry do? I will address the well-being part, and Irving will address all the medical-related issues. So when you talk about product development, communication, segmentation and what kind of properties I would look into in terms of development or management, or what direction should my property move, we want to give you a bit of a heads-up. We do a lot of intelligence development, and this was done together with the tourism association and IMTJ. I just want to give you a little bit of highlights. What is the difference in terms of traveling for various purposes domestically versus internationally? As you can see, in certain markets, domestic is way more important than international – there is a relatively good understanding all around Europe, for example, that traveling from abroad for wellness is something which is an important aspect people are now interested in. Questions like: What kind of options do I have? What kind of products can I have? I think it’s absolutely essential to highlight this, as we are in the first couple of minutes; that every market is very different as we see it. Just because you’re working for a product or development company or destination management organization or national government and you say that this product is popular in that market, therefore, I’m going to bring it in and bring it over. Please don’t do it, at least doing it with a pinch of salt because all the market intelligence that we have been creating for the last couple of years, including during the pandemic time, suggests that the markets do differ greatly and we will see how in a minute. 

    For example, when you say, “the Western European market”: what kind of facilities, properties, treatments, segments, services may be popular and expected to be put in the next three to five years post-pandemic? This gives you a rather good overview of what you should be aiming at in terms of development, in terms of vision, in terms of expansion. You can see that incorporating medical aspects could be something that really leads the way forward, Irving will be looking to those in a little bit. And what is medical in that sense? Is it therapies based on natural resources, moving away from wellness, but more like looking at therapies and modalities? What exactly is a medical spa or medical resort? How is this related to the wellness thought? How workplace wellness trips are going to come along? Are the companies ready to create these trips for their employees? Do they have the knowledge? Do they have the expertise to do that? If not, how are things going to happen? Because this is what the industry is really expecting. Whereas if you look at North America, you can see a totally different picture. You talk about non-invasive plastic surgery, which is more like changing the muscle tones and giving you advice, how to train your face muscles, for example, to look younger and to train it every day. Or we talk about spiritual and wellness, or going to festivals, which is very much a North American phenomenon. We need to understand: How eco-spas and wellness facilities may come along and what exactly do you need to do that? How are the healthy coworking complexes incorporating work, life and wellness actually going to be profitable? And how can you change existing blocks of offices into something like that? What’s the lifestyle-oriented retreat, which is a lovely title, but what does it do? How is it going to define this content and scope of services? 

    You can see a lot of changes. Now solo travelers are important, not just women, and there are segments looking for healthy options. So we have a lot of changes taking place. And the pandemic, if I may, has a good impact on this because people are more open. They are interested, and this is when we need to talk to them. This is about the travel agents and advisors who need to change the approach to not just selling it as a luxury opportunity. 

    Look at this title: it is hospitality’s largest block, which is wellness. This is a good thing for us. This is a good thing for business. Is it a good thing? Then everything is called wellness. Is it going to health development? How is it going to impact the ones that actually are offering this and how can we separate this from those who just use the label? It looks a lot like earlier this year, not that many months ago when we had that discussion going on. This is a bluff. Is it a bluff? Do we do enough to actually set the ground and set the circumstances so we cannot say that this is a bluff? How we can really separate those doing this for real from those that are using it as a label. I always want to highlight these qualities and understand that there is a lot of over and under in the business, the little over expectation, the loss of overdevelopment and overspending, whereas there is a lot of underperforming in terms of financial performance as well as our guests’ well-being. This is why we suggest not just creating a C-Suite, which is the corporate suite where all the various chief executives meet up, but having a W-Suite, which is a wellbeing suite where equally important decisions can be made. The C-suite and the W Suite would need to be at the same level and talk about what exactly are we doing for the development of the guests or even to those who are coming for business purposes? Or are they just coming and we may still be able to incorporate wellness improving components? This is when you need some help. You need to have advice. You need to have people who understand about being experienced engineers; how is it happening, that the guest journey is not just another bluff. How can you create the storyboards and the rituals? What exactly I need to do in-house and so on and so on. Otherwise, we will be focusing on the first three and spend a lot of money on space, but not very much on propositioning. And I had a discussion the other day with architects and it’s a revelation to many architects when I say, “I don’t want to build a building, I want to create some value added and value proposition to which I may need a building.” And not all of them understand what you’re talking about. 

    We knew that the end of the experience will mean that the heart rate is going to decrease, the cortisol level is going to decrease and the impact of nature and spending enough time in nature will be crucial. You may know in Canada, as of this year, that GP’s can prescribe spending time in nature on a prescription, which is an indication of how much we are deprived of being exposed to nature. 

    Dressing up a tree, you might say, “oh what lovely artwork.” Yes, it’s lovely artwork. You may even like it, but the whole idea is that I’m creating a situation of admiration in which being immersed in would have a great impact on the person’s well-being. You don’t need to be alone. You don’t need to be a medical device. You need to be a person who could be immersed in that experience. But this is our job: creating those experiences and situations. And one of the earliest examples, even if you read it six times, is an Israeli Desert Retreat to open an offering of CBD-infused camel milk massages. Even if you thought it was just to put together the various components of this service:chemical milk and massage with CBD infused as part of a retreat in a desert. It’s in Israel. It’s six senses labeled or branded. This year, this is just an example. I’m not advocating to have such an unusual package or such an ideal proposition, but why not? Because then it would be local. And obviously, that’s a fusion when you have CBD infused, let’s say. This is again an added value – what the impact of it is obviously something that needs to be checked. But I think it’s a good indication of directions. This is not money. This is understanding what wellbeing is, understanding how I can contribute to wellbeing and understanding how creative and immersive I need to be. So if you are doing any business development or service development, I really invite you to use this approach and check. Are you in the service business? Are you in the experience business or are you in the transformation business? And if you ask me, this is a sequence; you can’t change one day from a service business to a transformation business. We’re talking about contributing to local communities, regenerative travel and all these new buzzwords. This is nothing new in marketing and management, but I really invite you to revisit your services, if not in-house, then calling in experts and ask: Well, where am I? What exactly am I doing? Because of all these W-Suite approaches, this is what can help you. 

    Otherwise, you may use this and have this location in your place and bang your head here because you’re missing opportunities. The pandemic definitely made wellbeing as a core topic and how we are addressing it certainly depends on us. 

    A couple of take-home messages before I pass it on to Irving. This is always another option. There are always other options for alternatives. Don’t just talk to someone because a person is a hotel advisor and you want to have a hotel or spa advisor. You need to find the most suitable approach to yourself and also make a difference in what you wish to charge customers at the end of the day (what they pay for, or they pay the tax, or they pay the bill). But what exactly is it they’re paying for? And it’s really something that you need to revisit and evaluate, which starts from some very basic steps down to a full, wellness-oriented travel or service or package. There’s a long way to go, and this is the time to visit it. This is the time to check what you have been doing and how you can incorporate this wellness-ified approach of anything. It could be a travel management, a hospital, a clinic, a hotel, a resort, airline, whatever that is, because there are ways to do it, but sometimes you need a little bit of nudge to achieve that. So thank you very much for the first half of the presentation, I will pass things on to Irving. 

    Irving Stackpole Thank you, Laszlo, enlightening as always. It’s a pleasure to be here. I feel that the question Laszlo just asked, which gets right to the heart of designing consumer experiences and consumer services is: what is the customer paying for? That will come up again when I review the service lines that seem to be returning to life like a Phoenix rising from the ashes. But the question is: what can we expect? Business managers and executives of destination management organizations, these individuals and these organizations have a responsibility to try to anticipate what’s coming next. And that’s what Laszlo and I talk about often and what we consult with our clients about and what we’re attempting to share with you. And sometimes there’s clarity, and in some dimensions there’s more clarity than in others. 

    Let’s talk about what we can expect. For most of my comments, I’ll be talking in the relatively near term – that’s within 12 months or so. We can get to the question of what we can expect in part by looking at what we are for sure not going to see, and we’re not going to see this kind of stuff. These are recent headlines taken from publications. The buzz, the hyperbole, the exaggerations are beginning to return to the medical tourism rhetoric online and in public. We’re going to have a compound annual growth rate of 30 percent in medical tourism, or 21 percent as this other headline states. This is just not realistic, and it’s not what we should plan to see, nor what we can legitimately or correctly expect. One of the reasons for that is that the globe, the entire planet has been wrenched by the pandemic and the wrenching doesn’t appear to be over. We can see here in data from the recovery reports on gross domestic product in these countries, we can see that there’s significant variation in the recovery in these economies to the dual shocks that the pandemic has produced. 

    So the environment, the very context of asking the penetrating question that Laszlo raised, what are consumers paying for, is the context of what is occurring in their country. The source location, the destination location, are being profoundly affected by the political and economic events in that marketplace area. The other event or the other component has to do with some of the provision of services. Factors like labor, which I’ll talk about briefly. 

    One of the opportunities in global public health was the extraordinary, just exceptional rate at which vaccines were developed, and so we had within our grasp the ability to completely squelch this disease, this pandemic, through vaccination, distribution and uptake. However, there’s been uneven releases in the travel restrictions related to acceptance or failure to accept vaccines and the failure to have a uniform system in much of the world around vaccine recognition. We will be traveling the next few weeks and we are unsure of what to bring with us, so we’re just bringing everything, including our vaccination cards and negative PCR tests. Hopefully somewhere in that realm of paperwork the authorities at the borders will accept what we offer. 

    The other factor has been the public health responses by the governments, which have varied widely, and these are factors that restrict, restrain or create confusion. And these are factors that impact travel and tourism and therefore health tourism. What does recovery look like? Is it returning to normal, a new normal or something else? We believe it’s going to be halting over the next 12 months. There will be openings and then restraint, so it’s going to be on again, off again, in many ways, in many places. One of the factors that enter into this is the very nature of the markets for health, tourism and medical tourism in particular. These markets, as we’ve presented about before, are not one block. It’s not one thing, it’s a highly fragmented set of verticals that range from very low impact or very easy provision of service, certain cosmetic procedures and even the wellness procedures (the wellness treatments to which Laszlo was referring) all the way up to heart surgery and cancer treatments that are very complex. We can see that the motivations and the obstacles associated with those very different markets impact the recovery, the rate of recovery, and how these markets will indeed recover. There’s a real difference between high frequency, low acuity services. Simple procedures that are done frequently and with low frequency, high acuity procedures get very, very different markets and very different dynamics occurring in the markets. The range of services in medical tourism range from simple, low-impact diagnostics and checkups all the way up to organ transplants. This is a simple array attempting to display the range of complexity and certainly not intended to be comprehensive, but this bucket of potential services serves to show that there’s no one market. It’s not one product line that we’re talking about. We’re talking about health, tourism or medical tourism. One of the dimensions that we’re certainly encountering in the health and wellness and medical tourism markets is the pent-up demand created by the lockdown psychologically and behaviorally. We’re encountering populations that have never before been locked down, shut down the way the economies were. People feel constrained. There’s extraordinary psychological and social stress that is building up as the result of this and these human factors, these very human and cultural factors will find their expression in some very odd ways. I’m certain that some of you have read about the bad behavior of people on airlines. Some people have read about difficult, challenging situations at borders, and these are the kinds of social circumstances that frankly, no one could have anticipated because very few people anticipated the pandemic and how the pandemic would play out with this very uneven, inconsistent pattern of travel restrictions and travel restriction releases between and across borders. But there is pent up demand. Of course, the issue with pent up demand is that pent up demand is not sustainable. Pent up demand should not be seen as a return to normal. It is just that – it’s a temporary surge in the need for services, psychological or physiological as a result of a lockdown. 

    To Laszlo’s point about the labeling and branding of the services being provided, and the experience of the consumers who are consuming, whether they are wellness consumers, travelers or whether they are very ill consumers traveling to receive life saving treatments, there is a bridge or a chasm to be crossed in the health tourism journey. And this chasm, this journey, just got more complex with the situations presented by the pandemic. 

    It’s up to us as destination management organizations, as health and medical services providers, as wellness providers, to understand those shifts and to accommodate the consumers. Demand needs expectations. The question goes back exactly to what Laszlo suggested: what is it that people are paying for? Going forward, what’s our coaching to medical tourism and medical services providers who historically have attracted consumers from across national borders or who are now faced with the situation where they no longer have those consumers or have the volume of those consumers that they once had? What are their options? There are certainly new markets that can be looked at. That is to say, who is looking for services and why? There’s new service lines and there are new source marketplaces where people can be attracted from and across all of those three strategic options. There are the dimensions of the channels through which those consumers will be connected to you as the provider or you as the destination. I know we have good representation from both types of organizations. They are the new video conferencing services. They are remote. They are services at a distance. One of the limitations to the medical tourism markets historically has been a reliance on a legacy model of the strategy.Which was to attract consumers from other destinations to my destination. Because we have services that you don’t have where you live. We have a tradition of providing these services at a higher level. So come on over and receive your hair transplant or your Brazilian butt lift or your other procedure here where it’s less expensive. Well, those options may not still be available and consumers. One of the barriers may be fear or confusion that consumers have about their very ability to get to you. And so we need to deal with that, principally through communications and communications channels can include these video conferences. Telehealth, telemedicine. Remote care through various biometric sensors and sensing technology will indeed has been kicked into hyperdrive through the pandemic. It’s been extraordinary to watch the growth of these technologies overlapping in medical services, and we’ll see an acceleration of that in the future of these things. The barrier, as I’ve said, is a technical barrier. We, as destinations or as providers, need to find a way to address consumer’s fear and consumers’ confusion. Now, unfortunately, in the peer reviewed literature, there is extraordinarily limited amounts of research that’s been done about consumer fear and how consumers behave in the context of fear. Well, there’s never been anything like this before, so I guess in a sense that’s not surprising, but there is good information about how to deal with consumer’s confusion. Much of that research is about having too many choices, so narrow down choices and make things clear. And I would refer you to some of that scientific behavioral research as a way to determine in your promotions for your destination or your services how to clarify for consumers, reduce the confusion, increase the focus and package. Of course, in the past, we used to never talk about fear. Fear was the third rail of medical services marketing. Well, now we talk about safety, we do talk about safety, we talk about showing safety. We talk about symbols of safety. And these become important, whether they’re overt statements about standards in our cleanliness or whether they’re covert representations of our safety through images and other copy. So the WHO, we can be assured that in the medical services market. The consumers will be more sophisticated. Consumers are now having an opportunity to think about or learn about medical services to a far greater degree. Consumers are getting smarter. These consumers will be more sophisticated and therefore less price sensitive. That’s a challenge and an opportunity in and of itself. New service lines, technology, emerging technologies still and gene therapies. So-called personalized medicine is an example, and much of this can be accomplished remotely. And second, surgical opinions is another example. There are new source marketplaces where we secure consumers and also impact the level of capital investment, knowledge transfer and available labor. So these are issues that are resonating throughout the regional medical services markets for international and who’s going to come back first? What about the recovery? So the segments that are coming back that have already come back is the vanity, our cosmetic clinic clients are already seeing have seen for the past few months a boom in services. There seems to be a certain level of exigency around how people look on Zoom. So there is a surge in cosmetic dentistry, a concern, a surge in face appearance, enhancing procedures and the other end of the market that is emerging very quickly. What is the pent up demand around high acuity, life threatening types of procedures, cancer treatments, elective heart and cardiovascular procedures? Those kinds of procedures are indeed in high demand in certain regional markets, and those consumers are very motivated to overcome whatever barriers or whatever confusion is in their way in order to secure the services that they want and need. So what’s changed about consumer behavior is fear and confusion. This is still a media frenzy about COVID and now focusing on the irregularities, the lack of consistency between and among countries. What people see in the news has a tremendous impact on individuals willingness to consider consuming or considering consuming services abroad. Who’s not afraid? There are segments that are not risk tolerant, the elderly, the highly frail and vulnerable segments that are risk tolerant appear to be the younger, those folks who are seeking cosmetic and appearance enhancing or appearance altering procedures. So the WHO will be hesitant. We can address these by showing our ability to clarify the options for consumers if they want to travel from source location number one to your destination. How do we sort that pathway out for them and make it clear? Same is true with the providers. How do you overcome or counterbalance those fears and concerns by offering, as I mentioned, by offering clarification symbols and overt expressions of security, addressing the fear of contagion. Addressing the fears related to uncertainty about traveling and traveling to a destination where providers offer services to those consumers. The surge of pent up demand is officially here, and it is not stable and can go as quickly as it comes. The uneven response between and among countries across borders is delaying recoveries. Some segments are more risk tolerant than others based on those which are. That’s especially important in order to create a bridge of sustainable business as you go from Point A to Point B, which is probably sometime late in 2022 early 2023. Some segments are risk averse. We need to show safety as we’ve never shown it before and create visual and copy related textual proxies for safety. So with that, I would like to pause and suggest that we be available for questions. 

    Question: When are we out of the woods?  

    Irving Stackpole I didn’t include a timeline in this particular presentation. The reason for that is that I presented a timeline in the previous program that Laszlo and I created. And it’s bad business to be wrong at your predictions.There are a number of economists and cultural experts who were also very incorrect in their estimations of how things would shake out the EU. 

    They predicted a V-shaped recovery and that things would return to normal previous levels of economic development within eight months. It’s now been many, many more months than that. What’s holding us back is, of course, the irregularity in vaccine distribution, travel restrictions and the public health responses to the pandemic. It seems as though every time we make progress, there’s a rebound surge in infections among some group. We’re having that now in the United States, in children. There’s now a surge in child COVID cases. So it’s hard to say how long. Certainly, we would expect vaccine rollout to have an impact on the comfort level that people have about traveling by the third quarter of 2022. So they’re I’m on record. 

    Laszlo Puczko If I may add one point is that it doesn’t necessarily even matter. When? Because it will happen. We know that just because of what Irving said, it’s unpredictable. More like what we do about all of our existing or maybe planned propositions. Did you review your existing services? Did you revisit your plans? Are you open to these anticipated changes?  So I’m I’m I’m a little bit concerned that when I look at all those forecasts and trends and new openings and brand developments. . We can see new segments coming up. So that’s what I think should be really talked about and should be discussed. How I am as a brand, how I am as a destination. I’m at a clinic or hospital. I am doing the application of my services, how I am looking into options, not for medical tourism, but as a service provider, as a hospitality provider incorporating all these options. Hospitality is about taking care of their guests, which is directly linked to well-being.  Years ago, you could charge for Wi-Fi. I think, is totally misleading communication such as the one being used at medical tourism is going to grow by 30 percent in the next couple of years, which we have been seeing for the last 50 years. Every year that the next five to be 30 percent, none of which was justified, obviously. So, you know, these kinds of discussions we should really be having with brands and operators and developers in the sense that are we ready? 

    Yes. And I would add to that that underlying your observations, Laszlo, are the demographic facts that the generation that’s coming up. Is much more focused on authenticity and what you’re talking about in terms of brand. I would suggest one of the underlying one of the fabric elements of that is authenticity. So you can’t just slap a wellness label on top of your hotel without having authentic substance. We now do medical tourism on a destination and expect that anyone is going to think that’s authentic. You may secure a visitor or two who are desperate, but that’s not a sustainable business model. And ultimately. And there are some case studies about this. Ultimately, that’s damaging to the long term status of a brand to be discovered or exposed as inauthentic. 

    Laszlo Puczko And what would you say to CBD infused camel milk to Israel? Would it be authentic? 

    Irving Stackpole I think it’s a trick. I think it’s clever. I think it’s a clever convergence of the interest in CBD, which is definitely growing. Who doesn’t love camels? I mean, they’re so cute. Camel milk is kind of tasty. OK, I can do yoga, CBD and massage. I can put all of those together and inside my head that creates enough to make me perhaps want to inquire whether or not I would do that in that destination. I don’t know. So what do you think? 

    Laszlo Puczko It’s certainly stopping you for a second. How many of those actually can sell? People may try it just for the experience of it. But what exactly is selling? I’m selling a very good sounding thing, which says I’m using CBD for the following reasons, I’m using Camel only for the following reasons. And there’s the difference compared to use it. If I use this and this, it’s CBD, it wouldn’t have the same impact, so I would need to see the reasons and the benefits as well, not just the title, because the title is totally eye-catching. But you know, this might say that he’s going to be collecting a bonus. But you know, that’s the opportunity here for the more standard medical home medical proposition as well that rehabilitation prevention. How are you incorporating in a larger landscape, not just treatment in patient out sort of approach about you taking the retreat and the rehabilitation is provided either on site or off site? How is that relevant to your brain, to your clinic, to your specialists, to your doctors who have care personnel or the consultants, whoever that is? So going beyond that and when we do, then we do some medical tourism bingo with the health care professionals because you sounds like you’re a stupid you don’t play bingo with healthcare, but I do play bingo with CMO’s and CEOs and see whoever it is and hospitals. And you ask all these questions, and it’s very rare that they actually can say bingo because they recognize it’s a little bit more complicated than they thought. For gaming growth into strategic management, but yes, this is how you have the “aha” moment. 

    Irving Stackpole Yes. So we see this in the successful providers who manage to develop long term relationships with not only their prospects, but their consumers. So, for example, it’s one thing to do a hair transplant. It’s quite another thing to develop a relationship with a woman or a man around their hair transplant and around their grooming. So how do they see themselves? How do they present themselves? How do they groom post-transplant? It’s an opportunity for providers to differentiate themselves. Similarly, with other procedures as we’ll see. 

    Question: In your opinion, for the discerning medical traveler, what does a good safety message look like?

    Irving Stackpole I think a good safety message has images that show the end state securely so good safety messages are visual and some people are visual learners.  I want to see a masked doctor and a masked nurse interacting comfortably in the clinical setting with a consumer that looks like me. I think that shows comfort and safety. And you also want to carry over certain seals, certain cleanliness standards, and you want to have that text there. You may or may not want to put that in the headline, but it absolutely needs to be there to provide that. 

    Laszlo Puczko Just one more thing. Visually, yes, but also you need to see the presence. So you need to be reassured that there are people who are actually doing some cleaning activities on-site of your own. I can see it’s not just talking about it, actually, it’s happening. 

    Question: What does the panel’s think of Malaysian healthcare? Medical tourism in Malaysia? What can be further improved with the Malaysia destination? 

    Laszlo Puczko Well, first of all, Malaysia has organized their health tourism provision. Medical tourism provision in a distinctive way that, frankly, I admire. Second of all, Malaysia Health. Medical tourism was dependent on an important majority source market, which was rocked simultaneously with Malaysia and then as things quieted down in the source market. Malaysia got rocked and then as things quieted down in Malaysia, the source market got rocked again. So. The infrastructure is certainly there. They are among the most sophisticated providers in the world and I am a great fan. I’ve been there, I admire them. I’m an admirer of the destination of the provision, the way it’s organized, very sophisticated, high quality, and very focused on the patient journey. And so, you know, the touchstones along the patient journey,

    Irving Stackpole I think Malaysia is one of the very few countries I can count on business because they understand what they are doing, they’re doing it beautifully. There is the experience, there is the infrastructure, there are the human resources that the government supports. There is the organizational background. Everything is there. So you are ready to get to the next step. But some pilots with some pilot providers, not depending on the Indonesian market, necessarily because of the various limitations. How you incorporate the remote and become an information hub in certain indications and not actually patients coming to you, but medical service providers in the US inquiring about certain results of your treatments and this is what you are selling into the market. That would be ready to say to, all right, we’ve done our homework and we are ready to step up. You may have less numbers, patient numbers, but a value added would certainly be higher. So that’s what I would separate the patient numbers from creating the next level of Malaysia, value added. That’s what I would do. 


    Stackpole & Associates is a marketing, research & strategy consulting firm focused on international healthcare and seniors’ services markets. Irving can be reached directly at istackpole@stackpoleassociates.com.

    Health Tourism Worldwide provides solutions for every component of the health tourism spectrum from leisure to medical and wellness tourism.
    Laszlo can be reached directly at laszlo@htww.life
    htww.life

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